09 Dec 2010: Mugello

laurent resende wrote:in my opinion, the most urgent thing to correct, to have it and some other experienced pilots, is blocking the simulation at full speed, it is something completely new on netKar it would be very important to find out why, I know it was running on F1 2000 and 2002 on some models, and it came from the sound and hardware accelerated processing of the sound card, personally I have a "SuppremFX2" with which I never had a problem on other video game and simulation

the simulation really blocks ? / Are there special situations when this happens or is this just in normal running also ?
I know maybe something like that when someone rejoins the server then the graphic stops for a little moment.. but it is not a big problem I think, you don't lose any control when this happens.., because the game just stops in a whole, so every physic and input parameter gladly stops at the same time I guess.
But -another thing..: in 99% the car-model of the car that rejoins the server in not loaded by my PC.. (is this normal btw. ??), so you have to cope with this blue vector-cube-thing on track. This little thing needs to be fixed in the sim. .

In normal running I never experience a blocking of the sim (but to be correct: I experience some unclean performance issues since the last update even when you're only alone on track, the graphic sometimes shortly stops at one certain -always exactly the same- point on track.. . But this is not very often.)

Other performance issues happens when on the back of the grid + v miror on -then my graphic card always struggles a bit at more heavy tracks (maybe I should try to increase the graphic-performance of the ATI 5770 a bit, trying to tune it up a bit..).
but the first mentioned slowing-down-thing, when on the back of the grid, comes around because of all the massive netcode data supplied for each car to your PC I guess.. , so if so it would be no good idea to introduce even more cars than 15 to the grid without changing the netcode-technique too to be more fluend.. .

as I see the google translation completely distorts what I say I will write in French,

Marco quand je dis que comme moi quelques pilotes ont connu cette mésaventure, c'est l'arret totale de la simulation, avec un retour sur le bureau Windows, pas un ralentissement comme nous en subissons quasiment tous depuis la deriere mise a jour, NON ,UN ARRET TOTAL!!!!!!!un crash du jeu!!!! et je pense qu'il serait urgent de savoir pourquoi!!!!!

I have a 5770 and all is perfect, at 1920*1080 with AF 16x and 4x AA! So i think the vga isn't the problem, i think processor or Ram are the problem/s also the connection is candidate to be the problem! Hope this help you. PS Forgive my english!

Antonio Lallo wrote:I have a 5770 and all is perfect, at 1920*1080 with AF 16x and 4x AA! So i think the vga isn't the problem, i think processor or Ram are the problem/s also the connection is candidate to be the problem! Hope this help you. PS Forgive my english!

Yes, maybe it's a combination of some things, my board just uses DDR2 Ram (800MHZ 5-5-5-15). Anyway it's no problem, most of the time graphic is fluend, it just slowes down a bit when the road is crowded, mainly just after the start.. .
When I disable the v mirror then I have a lot more room available for the performance and things go a lot more fluend in those situations, but I rather drive with it on, to have better sight.

Especially at Adelaide I always had to turn it off., because otherwise with some cars on track in a race the graphic get's heavily struggling (it's because of the big 3D suroundings there, so somehow graphically I seem to have a bandwith problem). But when I turn v mirror off it's fluend again. So decreasing the sight-distance in the graphic options might help also a bit I guess, but I don't know -have't tried that out so far.

You need to make sure that you have Catalyst AI turned off in the ATi Catalyst Control Center. This has been known to cause problems in various applications. It might be worth turning off any anti-aliasing thats enabled in CCC. Just set it to application controlled. Also, what driver version are you using?

I've got a standard 4870 512mb with no overclocking or anything, have no problem with framerates, no matter what track i'm at.
I doubt its anything down to your ram, unless you're in the habit of running a lot of heavy stuff while you drive. 99% of people here are likely to be on DDR2 at around the same speed as you, and theres few people complaining of poor performance.

Ive found (nvidea) that I get slowdown when antialaising is set to x4 supersampling but if i set antialaising to x16 mulitisampling I get no slow down whatsoever with little if any difference in graphical quality.

Martin Hussey wrote:You need to make sure that you have Catalyst AI turned off in the ATi Catalyst Control Center. This has been known to cause problems in various applications. It might be worth turning off any anti-aliasing thats enabled in CCC. Just set it to application controlled. Also, what driver version are you using?

I've got a standard 4870 512mb with no overclocking or anything, have no problem with framerates, no matter what track i'm at.
I doubt its anything down to your ram, unless you're in the habit of running a lot of heavy stuff while you drive. 99% of people here are likely to be on DDR2 at around the same speed as you, and theres few people complaining of poor performance.

Thx, I will have a look at the AI setting thing 'cause as I see this is not disabled (no sign put in the box).., I never used any AA or AF neither in CCC nor in the game btw., Driver is 10.6, but all the issues were pretty the same with all the previous versions, so I don't think that it changes much when i install a newer one.

In Win XP (which I mainly use) I have btw. the 'problem' -since ever..- that this 3D preview window which is displayed in the CCC under the 3D options does not function -no graphic movement there..!, any idea why?
Under my Win7 installaton this preview function is working.

C group here all races
http://www.filefront.com/17632775/Lanzino_FormulaKS2_Mugello_2.rar

Grazie Andrea

M Waechter wrote:

Martin Hussey wrote:You need to make sure that you have Catalyst AI turned off in the ATi Catalyst Control Center. This has been known to cause problems in various applications. It might be worth turning off any anti-aliasing thats enabled in CCC. Just set it to application controlled. Also, what driver version are you using?

I've got a standard 4870 512mb with no overclocking or anything, have no problem with framerates, no matter what track i'm at.
I doubt its anything down to your ram, unless you're in the habit of running a lot of heavy stuff while you drive. 99% of people here are likely to be on DDR2 at around the same speed as you, and theres few people complaining of poor performance.

Thx, I will have a look at the AI setting thing 'cause as I see this is not disabled (no sign put in the box).., I never used any AA or AF neither in CCC nor in the game btw., Driver is 10.6, but all the issues were pretty the same with all the previous versions, so I don't think that it changes much when i install a newer one.

In Win XP (which I mainly use) I have btw. the 'problem' -since ever..- that this 3D preview window which is displayed in the CCC under the 3D options does not function -no graphic movement there..!, any idea why?
Under my Win7 installaton this preview function is working.

No idea why you're having the rendering problem in XP. You can try cleaning the ATi drivers with Driver Sweeper and reinstall them completely.

Shouldnt underestimate the changes a driver update can make. I've seen up to 30% performance improvements over a single update. Current version is 10.11.

Out of interest, what cpu do you have? and how much ram?

Potrei sapere perchè non ho ricevuto i punti di gara 2, mugello gruppo C, nonostante la mia decima posizione??
Grazie

perche' 17 laps down. Si prendono punti se si supera meta' gara.

capito, grazie

Martin Hussey wrote:
Out of interest, what cpu do you have? and how much ram?

is also wirtten my driver profile.. .
have an Athlon II X3 435, 2,9 MHZ, 4GB DDR2 800MHZ Corsair Ram on a Biostar Mainboard

With 3D Mark 06 I get something around 13500 result-points if I remember right.
I think system runs not bad, maybe the missing L3 cache of the Athlon II causes a bit performence issues in certain situations, (just a suggest).

I've no other actual games installed, so I can't rate the performance on other kind of games .
Someday I could also compare the performance of NKPro in Win7.. this way I would see if it works even better there for some reason.

Deactivating the Catalyst A.I. helped a bit btw. I think (tried that yesteerday): in Mugello graphic was a bit struggling for two moments each time just directly after leaving the pit-box,
now it is almost gone.

..Anyway, it's all getting a bit off-topic .

About the net code for the KS2 heres what Kunos had to say about it

"
no.. è la natura del multiplayer.. fai una prova, fatti una gara con la 1600 (wrecker permettendo ) o con il cinquino.. sembrera' tutto un altro multi. Purtoppo una macchina che fa quasi 4g laterali e quasi 5 in frenata come la ks2.. fai fatica ad "indovinare" dove sia.. quindi il multi è messo molto piu' in crisi. Questa nuova vettura fa a sento 1g laterale, quindi per il multi è tutto molto piu' facile e prevedibile."

Basically the upshot is the KS2 has upto 5gs acting upon it making it hard for the net code to predict were any car is when lag is encountered. The shelby only having 1 g acting upon it makes it easier to predict.
So we should have a lot less problems with it.

is it possible for him to change that for the whole game? there was a huge lag crash on server A at mugello on thursday causing 10 people to wait in the pits.

hopefully something can be done with the rest of the cars too

MikaRaymond wrote:is it possible for him to change that for the whole game? there was a huge lag crash on server A at mugello on thursday causing 10 people to wait in the pits.

hopefully something can be done with the rest of the cars too

guys watch the replays before speaking about lag. There was (almost) no lag there. Just a small error in the prediction of Gek's car on the first touch with Vanore. I analyzed the replay and log very carefully and I actually gave to Kunos report about it. I found something wrong on contacts. We performed some tests also, and we had some way to reproduce a strange behavior. Hopefully this will help fixing the problem.

Andrea Lojelo wrote:

MikaRaymond wrote:is it possible for him to change that for the whole game? there was a huge lag crash on server A at mugello on thursday causing 10 people to wait in the pits.

hopefully something can be done with the rest of the cars too

guys watch the replays before speaking about lag. There was (almost) no lag there. Just a small error in the prediction of Gek's car on the first touch with Vanore. I analyzed the replay and log very carefully and I actually gave to Kunos report about it. I found something wrong on contacts. We performed some tests also, and we had some way to reproduce a strange behavior. Hopefully this will help fixing the problem.

ive just been through this thread and agree with everything you say. i dont really know what im talking about so when i say netcode, i mean the lag / netcode / contact thing. you know what i mean ;D but yes, i agree the #1 priority for him is to decrease the chances of these things happening as often

Hi Andrea

You know, i'm new to your champ. My suggestion for this kind of crash can be the following:
- mantain the 5 corners rule, in order to have a clean start
- if there's a big accident in the first 2 laps, (cars going in the space...) a driver can ESC - gotobox, wait 1 lap and go out
If you change the time from 5 to 2 laps, you can have more realistic results, with the fastest drivers coming back to the other and having more battle for the win.

NB: only 1 fix of the car is allowed for each driver.

bye
Marcello

To be honest, I really hope that we will have our nice full mode sooner or later.
We have some time before our next KS2 race (Monza is on the 6th of January), and hopefully Kunos, will have some time to fix few nasty bugs that are creating us troubles at the moment.

Andrea Lojelo wrote:To be honest, I really hope that we will have our nice full mode sooner or later.
We have some time before our next KS2 race (Monza is on the 6th of January), and hopefully Kunos, will have some time to fix few nasty bugs that are creating us troubles at the moment.

to help us new drivers, when you get your full mode working again, could you please write a list out of what you can / cant do and the effect it has? like esc>pit will cost you 10 mins etc. for the first races i wasnt sure what would happen if i did a certain thing. when i refuelled it cost me 5 mins and wasnt sure what else would happen. id appreciate it if you could just do a small list in order for us to understand it a bit more cheers

in its latest version Kunos says he, quote :Redesigned multithread implementation on Online Race Lobby to use less CPU resources,this could be the cause of all delays experienced by the owner of multicore processors, trade with the graphics card is managed differently,secondly I noticed that when I was connected to the ranking of Jaap slowdown was much more common when the used the "nKServerTool" of Lastlace,all this being only personal observations, not Affirmative

to see if the memory management was the result of the slowdown on this latest version, I added a kit of "twin corsair dominator 2gig x2" bringing my 8-gigabyte memory, no difference it still idle,
other video games like "Call of Duty Black Ops" or flight simulation as "Rise of Flight" much more demanding, both in RAM and video memory that CPU has turned 90/120 fps on my config without any saccade or slow, so there is a problem with this version of NetKar
for those who want to increase their memory is not worth it changes nothing!

you do realise you can only utilise so much memory per game / application? even if you put 20gb in, youll still only need 1.5gb~ because thats all the game needs to run it

most games in today's world rely hugely on GPU power, obviously needing a powerful enough CPU to not create a bottleneck. thats what you should have spent your money on

I have a core 2 duo E8600 which turns has 3.6 giga, on GTX285, what is broadly sufficient to make turn Netkar correctly